Topic: 1970 302, having a few problems

[TheBigRedSled]

hey guys, i'm new to the board, found you guys through a search on the web

but enough about me, on to the mustang, a few years ago i got a 1970 coup, it was supposed to be my daily driver but it needed some work so it became a project car for a while, but one full set of brakes, a new shock tower, shocks, upper and lower control arms and 3 power steering pumps later she was ready to drive. the previous owner had cobbled the transmission together from 2 different tranys, but neglected to notic that the new franken tran didn't have a vent on either side, which i found out the hard way when it blew up. the engine is believed to come from a 1972 F-250, which brings us to the heart of the current problem.
at present the car is blowing oil out of the right valve cover bank, and out of the breather on the left side. this is something its never done before, and its something that is really worrying me. i read that using heavier oil might help with this some what, so i have switched to 20/50 and it is helping a bit, though i am still geting oil out of the breather cap.

the other problem i have been having is over heating. i have replaced the radiator, the hoses, i replaced the cowl the previous owned took off, i live in southern California so having a thermostat has proven to be a bit redundant so i removed it, i replaced the radiator cap which is coming in at 16 pounds, i'm not loosing coolant, i have a return tank.

the needle does a steady march up from one side to the other, its slowed down a bit on cold days, but on a hot dry day i can barely get to work. it blows a little smoke at start up but its not continuous and i don't see any water in the oil so i don't think its a head gasket.

anyone have anything like this happen to them, i've run out of fixes i can do myself, the only things i can think to do now is to flush the ports on the engine or get an aluminum radiator

[Soaring]

If it blows a little smoke at startup after running to the grocery store, you most likely have a leaking intake manifold gasket.  The smoke is basically white/gray and stinks like rotten eggs. 

[TheBigRedSled]

i'll check on that today and get back to you

[Ibadasgt-500]

You need a thermostat in place so the coolant in the radiator has time to cool before being circulated back into the engine. Not having water in the oil does not mean you don't have a head gasket or head problem. For instance if someone put the head gaskets on backwards you will have some coolant passages blocked. I have seen this many times. Does your car have a fan clutch? Have you checked for circulation?   

[TheBigRedSled]

thats an interesting point about the thermostat, i'd thought it was just there to allow the engine to heat up to running temperature

it does not have a fan clutch, but to you really think not having one would make this dramatic an effect?

[Jeff1967]

I agree a thermostat is a must, It is designed to regulate a consistent engine temp. and without one your engine will not operate efficiently. As for other recommendations to help the block cool is to add a six blade fan and a shroud. Are you running a 2 row radiator? If not it may come down to adding more 2 rows.

Hope this helps.

Jeff

[Ibadasgt-500]

Did you by chance check and see if the water pump is doing it's job? Just asking.

[Soaring]

A water pump either works, or it doesn't.  Most of the time, they start leaking because the shaft becomes worn, but they still pump.  Water pumps are a pain in the ass to replace, but if the radiator is going to be upgraded anyway, it would be a good idea to go ahead and replace the water pump at the same time. 

[TheBigRedSled]

not sure if the radiator is a 2 row,
the water pump is working, it was replaced about 5 months ago

[Ibadasgt-500]

A water pump either works, or it doesn't.  Most of the time, they start leaking because the shaft becomes worn, but they still pump.  Water pumps are a pain in the ass to replace, but if the radiator is going to be upgraded anyway, it would be a good idea to go ahead and replace the water pump at the same time.

I agree 100% but I have seen where the impeller will slip but the water pump won't leak. One more thing to check is make sure it has the correct ratio pulleys. 

[TheBigRedSled]

i know that the car was originally set up to run with an air conditioner, but it was removed by the previous owner, would that effect the pulley ratio?

[Soaring]

No, that will not affect the pulley ratio.  You can count the rows of your radiator by taking off the cap and count them.  The early Mustangs came with two row rads even though some were equipped with compressors for air conditioning. 

[TheBigRedSled]

ok its definitely a two row

[TheBigRedSled]

alright, just went to do the smell test on the smoke, it doesn't smell lie rotten eggs, but it is blowing a pretty good amount of an odd smelling sooty water

[Soaring]

Take that sucker out and drive it several miles.  A good 40-50 mile trip will do the trick.  What you have is condensation build-up, and you need to get rid of that moisture.  This is the season where we start seeing more and more of this sort of thing happening since the temperature of the Fall season is considerably lower than during the summer and the wam days and cold nights creates condensation in the exhaust system.  So, when you first start it up, you will get a drip out of the tailpipe and it will be black because of the soot build-up in the exhaust system. 
After doing that, and you still have the same problem, then you probably have a leaking head or intake manifold gasket. 

[Jeff73Mach1]

as to the thermostat-I just replaced mine as my car was pushing higher into the hot zone than I was comfortable with.  The cleveland engines often get the wron thermostat that allows water to bypass all the time.  I changed from an improper 195 to a proper 180 and the temps now stay closer to the cold side even though the cam is far more radical.

Running without a thermostat will definitely make a car run hotter as the coolant never spends enough time in the radiator to effectively cool off.

[Soaring]

Yeah, the 180 thermostat and a 13 pound cap is the ticket. 

[TheBigRedSled]

could i be putting too much pressure on the cooling system with the 16 pound cap?

[holdover]

16lb will raise the temp that the water will boil, but may be a tad high, especially if you have an old radiator. A 13 lb should be all that you need.

Is the engine still pushing oil out the breathers? If so check your PVC valve, it may be clogged and allowing your crankcase to over pressure. If the valve is OK find someone with a crankcase pressure tester, usually you place it over the oil fill point and monitor the pressure while at idle and when you give it a little throtle. If the pressure is excessive you might have a cracked ring or rings, normally the PVC valve will relieve normal pressure. Cracked rings usually throw alot of oil out the breathers, so unless it is really excessive that most likely is not your oil problem. You can comfirm ring problems with a leakdown test, if your valves are in good shape.

[nm12racer]

Hello

So were are you with this problem?

I would start with the PVC
Sound more like Head gasket or worn rings.

Since you were not loosing water, Don't think it will be Thermostat.